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From: Olof Johansson <olof@lixom.net>
To: Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab@kernel.org>
Cc: tim.bird@sony.com, ksummit <ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINER SUMMIT] community management/subsystem governance
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2018 18:16:40 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAOesGMiLCMiF5o=Os1KG6Tj=Tws_cum6PzoHK+-Fpeau5Pez5Q@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20180921140809.18ba8eae@coco.lan>

On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 6:08 PM, Mauro Carvalho Chehab
<mchehab@kernel.org> wrote:
> Em Fri, 21 Sep 2018 17:46:13 +0100
> Olof Johansson <olof@lixom.net> escreveu:
>
>> On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 6:18 PM, Linus Torvalds
>> <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> wrote:
>> > [ Still very much on break, but reading ksuummit-discuss and answering
>> > this one ]
>> >
>> > On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 9:35 AM Dmitry Torokhov
>> > <dmitry.torokhov@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 9:33 AM Luck, Tony <tony.luck@intel.com> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > Or, shock, horror, tell one-time contributors that it is OK to
>> >> > put the patch in an attachment to the e-mail.  Outlook doesn't
>> >> > (usually) mess with the contents of attachments.
>> >>
>> >> And then have maintainer having hard time trying to comment on said
>> >> patch in the attachment. I'd rather not.
>> >
>> > I actually think that *this* could be easily handled by trivial
>> > tooling that doesn't have to be set up over and over again inside
>> > companies or teaching people.
>> >
>> > In fact, doesn't patchwork already do exactly that?
>> >
>> > I have to say, there are real technical advantages to using
>> > attachments for patches, particularly when you have odd combinations
>> > of locales. It's gotten to be less of an issue over time and we're
>> > still almost entirely US-ASCII with the occasional UTF-8, but we do
>> > still have the occasional problem. Using attachments at least detaches
>> > the email charset from the user locale, and from random other MUA
>> > issues.
>> >
>> > But yes, the "comment on individual parts of the patch" part is very
>> > important too.
>> >
>> > The main problem with having something that rewrites things is that it
>> > breaks DKIM etc, so you can't just have a pure email gateway. It
>> > almost needs to be something at a higher semantic level like patchwork
>> > (that could still send out rewritten emails).
>> >
>> > In many cases, you might want that anyway (ie wouldn't it be lovely
>> > when the patch is also checked for "does it build" and looks up the
>> > maintainers based on what paths it touches etc etc).
>> >
>> > So a sane email / web-interface kind of gateway that allows people to
>> > work the way they prefer.
>> >
>> > But I guess "trivial" is completely the wrong word to use.
>>
>> We're already starting to use some bots that sit on the mailing lists
>> and monitor incoming material.
>>
>> This could be solved with something as simple as a bot that takes the
>> patch-as-attachment, does a few useful things like runs checkpatch and
>> makes sure it applies cleanly (maybe report what trees it applies
>> cleanly to, such as current mainline and next), and then inlines the
>> whole patch. All as a reply-all to the sender + original recipients.
>>
>> That way, anyone looking to do an inline review can do it on the bot
>> version, and the originator will still receive the feedback, etc. It'd
>> also solve the DKIM-related aspects, if I'm not mistaken.
>>
>> People who get distracted by the bot emails can easily choose to filter it.
>
> Seems to work.
>
> Still, there are some issues with that. Depending on the email client,
> it may not recognize the patch as is, and use a wrong mime-type.
> If the mail server doesn't recognize the mime-type, or considers it
> evil, it may reject the e-mail, and the bot will get nothing.
> Not sure what's the current status of e-mailers and patches, but on
> my past experiences on another company (lots of years ago), usually
> webmail solutions are worse[1], and don't properly tag certain types
> of attachments.
>
> [1] I know places where only a corporate webmail solution is allowed
> by default, and using any other solution would require an special
> security approval. Not sure if is worth to consider such scenario,
> though.

All of these sound like solvable problems to me, by having the bot be
lenient about what it accepts. It might get a bit messy and might need
tuning over time, but that's fine.

> Another problem is that bots will receive the same e-mail twice
> (the original one and the inlined one). We may start having
> multiple kernel-test robots reply for such emails, with is not
> a good thing. So, if done this way, it is probably worth to add
> some meta-tags to avoid the new e-mail with the same patch
> to be parsed again by (other) robots.

With only a couple of active bots, making them filter each other would
be a trivial initial approach.


-Olof

  reply	other threads:[~2018-09-21 17:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 162+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-09-10  8:59 [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINER SUMMIT] community management/subsystem governance Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 14:53 ` Linus Torvalds
2018-09-10 15:08   ` James Bottomley
2018-09-10 15:10     ` Linus Torvalds
2018-09-10 15:38       ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-10 15:47         ` James Bottomley
2018-09-10 15:55           ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-10 16:13             ` James Bottomley
2018-09-10 16:24               ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-10 17:10                 ` James Bottomley
2018-09-10 15:47         ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-10 15:56           ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-10 16:02             ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-10 16:07           ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 16:18             ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-10 16:23               ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 16:41                 ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-10 17:06                   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 19:48             ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 20:50               ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 15:49         ` Mark Brown
2018-09-10 16:33         ` Olof Johansson
2018-09-10 19:59           ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 21:30             ` Josh Triplett
2018-09-10 23:00               ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 23:16               ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11  1:14                 ` Josh Triplett
2018-09-10 15:13     ` Jiri Kosina
2018-09-10 15:20       ` James Bottomley
2018-09-10 15:31       ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-10 20:15       ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 21:09         ` Sean Paul
2018-09-10 21:38           ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-11 10:06             ` Leon Romanovsky
2018-09-11  8:44         ` Jani Nikula
2018-09-11  9:08           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-11 10:01             ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11 10:09               ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-11 10:17                 ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11 10:30                   ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-11  8:41       ` Jani Nikula
2018-09-10 15:31   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 16:39     ` Olof Johansson
2018-09-10 17:10       ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-12 19:02         ` Darren Hart
2018-09-12 18:59     ` Darren Hart
2018-09-12 20:05       ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-12 20:58         ` Darren Hart
2018-09-13 11:27         ` Mark Brown
2018-09-13 11:41           ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-13 17:08             ` Darren Hart
2018-09-13  2:56     ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-09-13  5:17       ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 15:56   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 20:32     ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 20:55       ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-10 21:33         ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 22:44           ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11 12:44             ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-11 14:35               ` Mark Brown
2018-09-11 15:17                 ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-11 15:02               ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11 22:00                 ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-11 22:17                   ` Guenter Roeck
2018-09-12  8:42                   ` Jani Nikula
2018-09-12 18:45                     ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-12 19:52                       ` Dave Airlie
2018-09-12 22:25                       ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-12  9:14                 ` Linus Walleij
2018-09-12 18:23                   ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-12 18:44                     ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-09-13 12:08                       ` Maxime Ripard
2018-09-13 12:57                         ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-13 13:18                           ` Maxime Ripard
2018-09-13 14:25                           ` Jani Nikula
2018-09-13 20:05                             ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-09-13 23:02                               ` Rodrigo Vivi
2018-09-14  6:47                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2018-09-14  6:39                               ` Dave Airlie
2018-09-14 14:15                                 ` Thomas Gleixner
2018-09-17  7:40                                   ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-14  7:08                         ` Linus Walleij
2018-09-14  7:39                           ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-14  8:08                             ` Linus Walleij
2018-09-12 21:21                     ` Linus Walleij
2018-09-21 16:05                 ` Joe Perches
2018-09-12 22:44             ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 22:56           ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-10 21:11       ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-09-10 23:05         ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-17 11:43           ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 12:03             ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-17 13:04               ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 13:10                 ` Julia Lawall
2018-09-17 13:29                   ` Christoph Hellwig
2018-09-17 13:48                     ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-17 13:58                     ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 14:18                       ` Christoph Hellwig
2018-09-17 14:50                         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-17 15:21                           ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 14:18                       ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-17 16:50                       ` Joe Perches
2018-09-17 14:14                 ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-17 14:59                   ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 22:39                     ` Dave Airlie
2018-09-17 23:04                       ` James Bottomley
2018-09-18  8:00                         ` Daniel Vetter
2018-09-18 11:16                           ` James Bottomley
2018-09-18 15:26                             ` Randy Dunlap
2018-09-18 16:47                             ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 16:59                               ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-18 17:08                                 ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 17:12                                   ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 17:31                                   ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-18 17:42                                     ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 17:55                                       ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-18 18:58                                         ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 19:24                                           ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-18 17:47                                     ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-18 17:49                                     ` Greg KH
2018-09-18 18:03                                       ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-18 22:46                                         ` Alexandre Belloni
2018-09-18 18:22                                       ` Dmitry Torokhov
2018-09-18 19:16                                         ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-09-18 18:56                                       ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-18 23:05                                     ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-18  7:37                       ` Nicolas Ferre
2018-09-18  7:47                         ` Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-09-18 10:38                       ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-18 16:02                         ` Mark Brown
2018-09-18 16:32                           ` Luck, Tony
2018-09-18 16:35                             ` Dmitry Torokhov
2018-09-18 17:18                               ` Linus Torvalds
2018-09-18 17:28                                 ` Sean Paul
2018-09-18 17:37                                 ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-21 16:46                                 ` Olof Johansson
2018-09-21 17:08                                   ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-21 17:16                                     ` Olof Johansson [this message]
2018-09-18 17:21                               ` Mark Brown
2018-09-18 21:01                               ` Steven Rostedt
2018-09-18 23:16                                 ` Laurent Pinchart
2018-09-18 23:54                                 ` Mark Brown
2018-09-19  5:27                                   ` Christoph Hellwig
2018-09-19  9:46                               ` James Bottomley
2018-09-18 17:10                             ` Tim.Bird
2018-09-18 20:48                             ` Takashi Iwai
2018-09-18 16:50                           ` David Woodhouse
2018-09-18 17:24                             ` Mark Brown
2018-09-18 19:22                               ` David Woodhouse
2018-09-18 19:30                                 ` Sasha Levin
2018-09-18 19:38                                   ` Josh Triplett
2018-09-18 19:48                                   ` David Woodhouse
2018-09-18  8:24                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2018-09-17 13:12             ` Christoph Hellwig
2018-09-17 14:14               ` Mauro Carvalho Chehab
2018-09-17 21:59               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2018-09-17 22:17                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2018-09-10 21:19       ` Konstantin Ryabitsev
2018-09-11  8:33         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2018-09-10 16:29   ` [Ksummit-discuss] Fwd: " Daniel Vetter
2018-09-11 15:35   ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Jiri Kosina
2018-09-17 11:11   ` [Ksummit-discuss] [MAINTAINER SUMMIT] Live without email - possible? - Was: " Mauro Carvalho Chehab

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